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Initial evidence for the baptism in the Holy Ghost

Does one have to speak in tongues in order to be considered "Spirit Filled." It is my position 1) EVERYONE can and SHOULD speak in tongues 2) but , I also believe that there are many people who are Spirit filled and do not speak in tongues "YET". Is speaking in tongues a or the sign one has been Spirit filled?

Thoughts ......

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Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Pastor James and Lucia Purser on August 9, 2008 at 2:26pm: Jerome , I agree with you brother. Here is my question...Can you be filled with the Spirit and not speak in tongues. My position is yes. Yet , I also believe that all can and should speak in tongues after being Spirit baptized; ▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Pastor Jerome H. Weymouth on August 15, 2008 at 9:20pm: Again i state my position: People who get filled with the Holy Spirit will speak in other tongues and if not now then later, If they say I got filled when Pastor Prayed for me then who is the Pentecostal to say that they didn't? But the average Pentecostal says that when you "Schicka mo shi"
then you have received!. They put the horse before the cart! When it comes to receiving a physcial healing it is received by Faith, not when you get the healing that your healed. Pastor James you and i know that every thing that is received from God had to be received by faith. The old argument says nothing happened when I got prayed for means one thing.... Mis-education, unconfessed sin, worldiness, some people are in disobedience and God wants them to get more committed......The scripture says "that God gives the Holy Spirit to those who obey him"
Well i know i just made somebody mad when i said that but it is the word and you can't lose with the stuff we use!; ▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Pastor James and Lucia Purser on August 9, 2008 at 3:12pm: My issue with the question is such. This is what I teach . The word "filled" in the greek has its root in the word or idea of surrender. So the initial evidence that one has been "Spirit filled should not any giftings of the Spirit , but actually a surrendered life. Once that person has surrendered their life that leaves room for the charismata to be demonstrated . As for tongues...I believe EVERYONE born of the Spirit can experience tongues ,and should expect tongues. The issue that I have is when believer's feel something has happened to them when they prayed for the baptism , yet did not experience any signs such as a tongues. I actually encourage disciples to believe that they received the baptism , if tongues did not happen I tell them it will. Upon being filled , which should occur many times, they will speak in tongues one day. I hope this makes sense?

James Purser; ▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Robert Jimenez on August 10, 2008 at 9:01am: It still seems to me from previous studies, I would have to go back an reread the scriptures that all experienced some sort of manifestation. Even though Paul did not initially speak in tongues he did receive a miracle/healing.; ▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Pastor Jerome H. Weymouth on August 10, 2008 at 3:05pm: Bishop Robert is right but Paul did speak in tongues, He did say that I speak in tongues more than you all!; ▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Pastor Jerome H. Weymouth on August 10, 2008 at 3:01pm: Thank you Pastor James, we are in agreement on this
issue that everybody who is filled with the Holy Spirit will speak with other tongues, And they will !! if not now -then later on. and again there is a issue there. Kenneth Hagin said it was a issue with the believer (i'm not going to act crazy when I get filled, said one lady and her defenses were up at that time of prayer.) Foundations of Pentecostal Theology said it could be wrong teaching, unbelief, nervousness, fear, and sin. And of course they will be those who disagree with what i'm saying and want to rail on me but who cares! I'm going with the word of God and it says that all who are filled will speak with other tongues!!; ▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Christopher Chapman on August 11, 2008 at 9:16pm: Pastor James (Randy Speaking)
I hold the same exact position as you do on this.; ▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Christopher Chapman on August 11, 2008 at 10:21pm: randy,

you hijacked my profile!!! thats alright cousin, since you give me a free place to sleep in the states, and this is your computer!!!; ▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Robert Jimenez on August 12, 2008 at 7:16am: Chris is evolving before our eyes, he is now a duality and is talking to his other person, now known as Randy. - hahahaha ;-); ▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Christopher Chapman on August 12, 2008 at 11:40am: lol!!! haha!!!; ▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Pastor Jerome H. Weymouth on August 15, 2008 at 9:23pm: You have said it right! and we both say the same thing!; ▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Robert Jimenez on August 12, 2008 at 10:32am: I thought I would take just a few moments and quote from Foundations of Pentecostal Theology (FPT) because I do think that they have a fair and good understanding of the baptism with the Holy Spirit. I know you are all old Pentecostals and like the term Holy Ghost, but I don't ;-) so pardon me for the updated use of Holy Spirit.

According to FTP Chapter "Doctrine of the Holy Spirit":
The Baptism with the Holy Ghost is a definite experience, subsequent to salvation, whereby the Third Person of the Godhead comes upon the believer to anoint and energize him for special service. This experience is designated, in the New Testament, as the Spirit "falling upon," "coming upon," or being "poured out upon" the yielded believer in a sudden and supernatural manner.

Now the first thing I notice is the absence of tongues in their definition of what the Baptism with the Holy Spirit is.

Next they define "The Evidence and Results of the Baptism with the Holy Spirit."

According to FTP Chapter "Doctrine of the Holy Spirit":
An experience so great and so important as the Baptism with the Holy Spirit undoubtedly will be accompanied by unmistakable evidences, so that the recipient will have no doubts whatsoever that he has indeed received the Promise of the Father. Some of the evidence is manifested immediately, while others continue on a permanent basis as one walks in the Fullness of the Spirit.

...We believe that the initial evidence of the Baptism with the Holy Spirit is that of speaking with other tongues as the Spirit gives utterance...

The reasoning for this statement according to FPT is:
What the disciples did when they were first filled, we reasonably expect all to do who are filled in the same sense. Inasmuch as the purpose of the anointing was to give power to witness, it is not surprising that the sign of the experience was manifested in their utterance.

However, they do go on to say that:
Speaking in tongues is not the Baptism with the Holy Spirit - it is the initial evidence but not the only one...Other immediate evidences of a new experience of the anointing of the Spirit in the life will include: praise to God (Acts 2:11; 2:47; 10:46); an overflowing joy (Acts 2:46); a deep burden and desire to preach or testify about Jesus (Acts 1:8; 2:14-18; 3:31; 19:6).

Even though they hold to speaking in tongues as the initial evidence they do allow room for other immediate evidence as stated above. I think that is a fair and balance approach and understanding to this topic. Also keep in mind that this has nothing to do with church dogma. If the pastor of his church thinks that speaking in tongues is the true and only sign of being filled with the Holy Spirit then it is his right to exercise that position in his church.

Again the goal here is not to go to our churches and dictate what should or should not be the position of what our church teaches in regards to this matter or to undermine the position it has taken. Our goal is simply to try and understand as best as we can.; ▶ Reply to This